I (42F) might lose my older brother (47M) after his son (20M) hit his sister (18F). How can I remain civil with them?
A Reddit user is grappling with a painful family conflict after stepping in to protect her niece from years of abuse by her autistic nephew. Her intervention, which included involving the police.
Has caused a rift with her older brother, who downplays the severity of the situation. The user now seeks advice on maintaining civility while prioritizing her niece’s safety. Read the original story below for the full details.
‘ I (42F) might lose my older brother (47M) after his son (20M) hit his sister (18F). How can I remain civil with them?’
My older brother, Kevin, has 2 kids with his wife, Lisa (40F); Frank and Abbie. Frank is a low functioning autistic. Last night, I learned during the family Christmas get-together that Frank had been physically abusing Abbie for years. This morning, I had to get Abbie out of her house before Frank could hit her with her softball bat.
Because I was worried for other people’s safety, I got the police involved. They did a welfare check at Kevin’s house and got our statements.. Kevin is furious with me right now. I don’t know if he doesn’t realize just how bad the abuse was, or if he’s in denial or what.
He’s been telling the rest of our families and friends that I’m the bad guy for involving the police in a “small family dispute” (his words, not mine). Kevin also told me that he was scared for Frank getting arrested for aggravated a**ault charges because “he can’t control who he is” (again, his words, not mine)..
I lost my temper and told him that he and Lisa were horrible people for letting this happen and that they’ll be lucky if they still have a daughter when this all settles down. I even asked him if it was going to take the sight of Abbie being taken to the hospital or the morgue before he realizes what a monster he and Lisa have created.
I know that probably wasn’t the right thing to say but I was so angry.. As much as I don’t want to blame Kevin for reacting the way he did (I would probably react the same way if the situation was reversed)…I’m pissed at him for allowing Frank to abuse Abbie like that. They dropped the ball big time on their daughter.
She’s got a black eye from yesterday when Frank punched her for her Christmas gift. She’s also a nervous wreck, blaming herself for all of this going down when Lisa went on her for the welfare check.. I’ve been looking for therapists for her and convinced her to turn off her phone rather than listen to her parents.
I also got takeout from her favorite restaurant and playing video games with her, just to take her mind off of the day.. Abbie has asked me if she can permanently stay with me and I’ve agreed. I’m going to have to remain in contact with them because it’s clearly not safe for Abbie to return, at least as long as Frank is there..
This is the first time I’ve ever seen Frank violent enough to hurt someone. Whenever I’ve been around him, except for a few times that he’s had a meltdown…he’s always been sweet, loving and caring. After everything that has happened in the last 24 hours, I’m wondering if that was all a lie.
Seeing him come after his sister with her softball bat still disturbs me.. And as angry as I am at Kevin…I don’t want to lose my relationship with him. We were as thick as thieves growing up and we’ve always had each other’s backs. Several years ago, I was let go and was facing homelessness.
Kevin and Lisa opened their home to me, despite being up to their eyeballs in student loan debt. They let me stay until I was able to get a place to live and a better paying job. They even refused to let me pay rent/utilities, telling me that “we’re family and you’d help us out if the situation was reversed”..
He’s my big brother and I still love him, even though I’m pissed at him.. I’m not ready to torpedo my relationships with Kevin, Lisa and Frank…but if Abbie’s wellbeing means doing that, then so be it. It’s time someone looked out for her for once.. So once our tempers have stopped flaring; how do we rebuild so at least things are civil between us?.
Check out how the community responded:
LameName1944 − It’ll be interesting how they feel in a bit once they realize Abbie isn’t there to take the brunt of it. Wonder which parent will become the target now. I’d let things cool and take it day by day. Keep Abbie away from them and just see what unfolds. There is going to be forced help here soon enough.
Bluest_waters − Unfortuantely there is a high rate of s**ually innapropriate behavior for low functioning autistic young men. I would not be surprised to find out there was s**ual abuse along with the physical. She needs a safe place to live and therapy. Thank you for providing the former.
Secondly I would send an email, not a text, to all family members describing this as *long term physical abuse*, NOT a one time incident and that you were terrified for the well being of your niece. Inform them of the full breadth of the situation, don’t let Frank spin this. They need to know.
As far as Frank goes, he is forcing you make a choice: The safety and well being of your niece, or play along with his denial and abuse. So those are your two choices. Sometimes life sucks, and this is one of those times.
Make your choice and let Frank do what he wants, its not your problem. Grieve for the loss of your relationship with Frank and pray that someday it can be mended, but that day is not likely today. God bless and I really hope things turn out well for the girl.
Haunting-blade − It sounds like unless they wake up to how Abbie has been treated (and from their frantic downplaying and dismissal, this obviously is not the first time), then the price of entry to any kind of relationship with Kevin is Abbie’s wellbeing. As you’ve said, that’s unacceptable. Resultantly, this isn’t actually in your control.
I appreciate the impulse to act, to try and take some control back when so little of what is happening is within your remit (Kevin and Lisa’s acknowledgement and denial, Frank’s treatment and behavior, cps’s outcome, the police and any charges or interviews, Abbie’s mental wellbeing).
All of those depend on other people and having your life turned upside down because of them is very difficult to cope with. Abbie is the priority right now. Frank has his parents in his corner, but she has no one.
Keep your distance from her parents, show Abbie you are entirely on her side, and get therapy for both of you; this has been traumatising for everyone involved.
This may cost you your relationship with your brother, for which I am sorry, but in the same way as when you leave an a**sive partner, you may not be mourning who they actually are, but who you thought they were.
Elfich47 − How much of the care taking of Frank wax pushed down onto Abbie? It sounds like there was a lot of denial. And I expect that your brother and his wife are about to have a serious lesson now that Abbie has fled the house.
Sandmint − Kevin and Lisa’s failure as parents drove the wedge, not Frank. Not this one event. A lifetime of refusing to escalate Frank’s care to keep Abbie safe. Kevin and Lisa have allowed Abbie to be physically abused for years.
She has been abused, neglected, and her parents don’t give a f**k about her safety. I don’t know how you could be civil. See your brother for who he is. An enabler to abuse. Frank is too large for them to handle. Kevin knows Frank is a monster. He sees what Frank does. He’s told Abbie to be quiet and take it.
They didn’t just drop the ball; they welcomed it because they know he’s a grown man with uncontrolled, violent outbursts. They don’t care to keep things like softball bats out of access. They allowed this.
They knew. It’s great that you and Kevin were thick as thieves and always had each other’s backs, but he doesn’t have his daughter’s back. It’s sad that Frank has autism to this level of disablement.
Your brother is an enabler and didn’t bother to take care of either of his kids. Frank needs to be in a facility that’s actually equipped to take care of him so he’s not a danger to himself and others. I can guarantee Abbie is a glass child. Look it up.
ooragnak_ume − Does Frank hurt Kevin and Lisa in the same way? If not, then frank absolutely has the capacity to not hurt people and your brother and SIL are horrible people for letting their other child be the sacrificial lamb.
If he does, then he is uncontrollable and the entire family needs assistance. Either way, Abbie does not deserve to be Frank’s literal punching bag. You are doing the right thing in protecting her.
WomanWhoWeaves − Good luck. Thankfully Abbie is 18. Keep her with you and start the therapy stuff. Learn to say “I’m sorry you feel that way, I am doing the best I can for Abbie.”
shellontheseashore − (Saying this both as an autistic person, and a survivor of abuse within the family unit, that led to estrangement/no reconciliation.) It’s likely a situation where this got bad over time, to the point where there was no dramatic incident (from their perspective) that required intervention. ‘Frog boiling in a pot’ stuff.
The priority has always been Frank’s care and stability, at the expense of any other member of the family unit. That part isn’t really even anyone’s fault, depending on how much resources the parents have access to. Frank isn’t a monster.
It isn’t his fault for being high support needs, although they’ve clearly outpaced what his family is capable of providing, and have for a long time if Abbie was sacrificed as a buffer.
The responsibility lay with the parents to care for *both* their children, and get more help if needed – but when it’s been a lifetime of “don’t rock the boat, keep everything stable so Frank stays stable” I see how it gets here. It’s not acceptable, but each step of the way made sense to them at the time.
Better and more available support could have prevented this, and potentially offered a road into out-of-home/respite care if needed. But there’s huge issues with that system too, and I understand if they rationalised they were protecting him from worse potential s**ual and/or physical abuse by allowing ‘a little’ suffering for Abbie.
That fear definitely shows in his reaction to the cops being called (and yeah, mentally ill/disabled folks are at higher risk of police violence). His fear comes from a genuine place, but it led to sacrificing one child for the other. Still a terrible outcome for both.
Abbie’s wellbeing is going to be your priority, and it might mean you lose contact with your brother. A therapist for her is absolutely necessary (and one for you for guidance navigating this situation would also be great), especially if you can find one experienced with ‘glass children’
(aka, well siblings of chronically ill/high needs children who become parentified/neglected compared to their sibling). A support group down the line may also be beneficial. Be prepared for Abbie to have conflicting feelings, and potentially want to resume contact/attempt to find some kind of balance.
This likely won’t be healthy if nothing has changed around Frank’s care/her parents are still normalising the events, but it hurts to lose your family like this. It’s shattering to have to beg for scraps and still have them choose someone else over you.
Civility for her sake would be helpful, while maintaining that what they allowed was dysfunctional, and harmful to both her and Frank. Acting harshly in her defence may make her close down and not feel safe giving you more details, as she doesn’t want you to hurt people she still likely cares about.
(This is especially important as, as others have mentioned, there is a potential risk of SA having also occurred. I hope not, but given the family dynamics and rugsweeping it shouldn’t be ruled out pre-emptively.)
The other comments mention sending an email countering Kevin’s claims and outlining the long-term physical abuse. I would not do this without discussion with Abbie and getting her feelings on it, and potentially therapist involvement (as she may experience a lot of guilt/self-blame for the events).
Acting without her consent will not be helpful, and she needs to be included in discussions. While the abuse started while she was a minor, she is now an adult (if barely), and having control over what happens with the information is very important for survivors
(after I disclosed that I was SA’d by family, the ‘news’ was spread without my consent – while I could overhear half the conversation too, god – and made me a pariah. It was doubly traumatising). Support means respecting her autonomy when it has been neglected for so long, while also helping uproot any self-blaming beliefs that have grown.
‘Ring Theory of Grief’ may be useful for you in managing your emotions around this, while still being able to be present and support Abbie. Your anger is secondary to what she needs here, as the primary victim.
Both Kevin’s children have been (unintentionally) neglected here, even if Abbie is bearing the brunt of the consequences. Please keep that in frame, as things progress.
Stompanee − Focus on Abbie. Forget Kevin and his feelings towards you. Forget Lisa and her feelings towards you. Forget Frank and what his diagnosis is. Abbie has had her short lifetime filled with abuse, guilt, blame and shame. You have saved her and you will need to continue to protect and rebuild her.
I cannot stress how much it must be all about Abbie now. Thank you for being there for her. She needs you and will need you for a very long time. Therapy for her. Therapy for you. Therapy for the both of you.
As she is 18- you do not need her parents permission for anything. I’d even say get a lawyer if you are able. Change all. Her emergency information at the school as well. And continue to pursue the legal route against frank as wel
IHaveABigDuvet − The priority right now is to ensure your nieces safety. She has been physically abused for a very very log time and its unacceptable. I think you should also see a therapist about how to navigate your feelings surrounding your brother and what “family loyalty” means to you.
When family loyalties clash with the need to protect a vulnerable loved one, how can you navigate such complexities? Should relationships be mended, or does safeguarding someone’s safety take precedence, even at the cost of familial bonds? Share your thoughts below!