UPDATE: My (31F) husband (41M) makes mean jokes and I want to help him stop before we have children

A Redditor (31F) reached out after seeking therapy to address her husband’s (41M) pattern of manipulative, controlling, and demeaning behavior. After discussing it with a therapist, she was encouraged to reach out to a domestic violence organization for help with an exit plan and legal aid for a potential divorce.

Although she’s heartbroken and conflicted, realizing that her situation qualifies as verbal abuse has been eye-opening. She’s now questioning how to move forward and whether to stay or leave, especially since she’s unsure if her husband will ever fully understand his actions. Read on for her update.

‘ UPDATE: My (31F) husband (41M) makes mean jokes and I want to help him stop before we have children?’

Ok. I talked to my therapist (who I was seeing because husband had me believing I had emotional regulation & communication problems), came armed with research and concrete examples of his manipulative, controlling and demeaning patterns.

She was supportive but firm, recommended I reach out to my local DV organization to help me work out a safe exit plan and get legal aid regarding the divorce. She said sooner rather than later. And I trust her.

But… I am stunned. I feel like my whole entire world is upside down. I keep flipping back and forth between “thank god other people can see this too, I’m not crazy and it is that bad” and “he’s my best friend, I’m heartbroken and he’s the only one there for me, he needs me and I could never leave him.”

I know I should leave but I don’t know what to do. I just want to talk to him and work it out and this will all just be one big misunderstanding, right? I’m heartbroken. I can’t have kids here, but if I leave I’ll be alone and also probably won’t have kids. And I’ll be broken and ashamed. All those conversations. He’s going to want me back or want an explanation.

I really think that’s what I’m hung up on the most. He has so little emotional awareness that I KNOW he won’t have any idea what I’m talking about. I know he’ll think I’m crazy. I want him to know what he’s done but he just… he’s not going to. He might not ever understand. We’re so happy so much of the time, I don’t know if I can do this. Anyways, hi, worst update. But you all were right.

For anyone in a similar situation, Lundy Bancroft’s “Why Does He Do That?” was very eye opening and described him in ways I couldn’t articulate on my own. He fits the profile of the Water Torturer perfectly.

Additionally, very very helpful these past few days: The Hotline (looks like I can’t link, but you can search.) They have a text or chat service, and for anyone out there like me, it’s not “just” emotional/verbal abuse, it’s abuse and they are there to help and support. I spent a few hours over a few days just talking through things with people who really understood and it was exactly what I needed. Please reach out if it’s something you need.

TL;DR My husband isn’t mean, he’s verbally abusive. Don’t know what’s next.

Here’s what people had to say to OP:

loryhasreddit −  I saw your original post and tbh, this is the best thing you’re doing for yourself. Never mind the age gap, it’s so clear that he spent 10 years breaking you down and tearing apart your confidence that you think at 31 years old, you’ll be broken and alone. You won’t be.

No matter what he says, you are deserving of love and kindness, and not whatever this man was doing to you. You don’t deserve a man who treats you like that. You deserve someone who you know you can have kids with without asking to stop behaving in a blatantly harmful way. You will find someone! You will be okay!

redlightsaber −  In your other thread, in response to a comment you justified yourself by saying. But it’s me, not a child. I’m a full grown adult who got herself in this spot. He didn’t say those to a child, and if he had it would be different.

I just wanted to let you know that you need to let yourself off the hook for a bit. You were **indeed** a child (well, a teenager) when this grown-ass 30 year-old walked into your life, dazzled you and made you feel special in ways only someone with much more life experience can, and didn’t even give you emotional room to grow into a person who could see that was he had been doing all along was indeed abuse.

You’re 31 now. Take a look at 20 year-olds today. Do you feel you have anything in common with them? Can you picture attempting to get into any sort of romantic relationship with a 20 year-old boy? Do you feel that’d be fair, that you’d be in any way equal, that he’d have any chance of knowing what was going on at the time?

This is what your husband did to you. And he did it to you because no woman his own age would have taken his “lol joking” b**lshit. I know you’ve had a **rough** week during which a relationship you thought was “mostly fine, most of the time” got revealed to be something much more grim for your future and expectation of happiness.

I don’t intend to pile onto that. You’ll need a bit of time to assimilate all of this, to heal, and eventually, to rebuild your life. I just want to help you shut down that part of your mind that’s still going “but he’s my best friend! The poor guy surely doesn’t even know that what he’s been doing is wrong!”. There is no excuse.

Everyone has to find their own way in life; it’s his responsibility as a grown-ass adult to choose to better himself if he finds himself having trouble relating to mature women. You bear no responsibily for this. I understand you’re afraid, because, very unfairly, he witheld your chance to experience adulthood as a single woman.. Take care.

magicmuggle12 −  I completely understand why you want him to accept and understand and admit what he’s doing, but he almost certainly won’t. You don’t need him to validate it to know what’s going on, because YOU know. You will be ok. But you need to leave.

joycatj −  I just wanted to say that the belief that if you leave you will be alone and not have children is a false belief. I divorced when I was 33, had no kids. I felt exactly like that. A year after I was in a stable, loving, great relationship with a new man and got pregnant. We now have a son and are thinking about trying for another one.

I’m 37 now. It’s not too late. This relationship is so much better and more loving than my marriage and I would never have known that this was possible if I stayed married.

My ex husband wasn’t emotionally abusive but very emotionally closed off. It helped me to think that he acted like he did because he didn’t have the capacity to do it any other way. I could not fix him or just use the right words and then he would understand and act differently. He didn’t have the capacity. I could not provide that capacity for him. It was on him.

CactusMcChicken −  You will be so relieved and free when you finally leave. It’s going to be awesome. He’s not half the man anyone thinks he is.

mischiffmaker −  The comments pointing out the difference in your age gap are spot on. I guarantee that when you leave, your hopefully-soon-to-be ex will start dating young women in their early 20’s.. Why?

Because young adults are vulnerable. They’re trying to finish growing up but lack life experience. They’re easy to manipulate and train into an abuser’s desired behaviors, just the way puppies and young dogs are.

“You can’t teach old dogs new tricks” is a saying not because old dogs can’t learn, but because it takes so much longer to convince them to change their behaviors. But. You aren’t a dog. You’re a human being–with agency.

Age gaps don’t necessarily mean a problem. My dad was 36 when he married my 22-yo mom. I grew up in a loving, supportive home, with a tight-knit sibling group. When my dad developed Alzheimer’s disease, the one person he never forgot he loved (even if he couldn’t always say her name) was his wife. He was the kindest, gentlest man I’ve ever known, and my brother is the same.

But in your case, it put you at the mercy of a manipulator. As far as having kids? My mom was 40 when she had my youngest sibling. One of my older sister’s friends had an oops baby at 56 because she thought she was done with menopause.

At 31, you’re just entering the age when your generation is having children. There’s no need to despair. My dear friends’ daughters had their babies closer to 40 than 30. In my case, the older I got the less I wanted to go through pregnancy or childbirth–I say “less,” but I never actually *wanted* to be pregnant or give birth It was just what people did.

I never really wanted to be a parent, ever. I knew just how much work it would be and I didn’t want it. I learned, about myself, that I just am not a caretaker. I can do it in short bursts, but not over a decades-long haul.

Leaving my abusive relationship at 29 and spending time living alone helped me figure out my own strengths and weaknesses, what I wanted *my* life to consist of. I started applying higher standards to the people I let into my life, and tried to live up to them myself.

I am happily retired, childfree, and single. I share an adult family of choice with a sibling, their partner and another close friend. None of us wanted or have children at all. My AFoC also includes siblings and a network of friends who lasted through the decades.

You may feel like you’re running out of time. But if you leave this relationship, you’ll find you have all the time you need to find out what *you* really want out of life.. *Hugs* and good luck to you!

lesslucid −  He’s going to want me back or want an explanation. …and you can just say no. His demands for an explanation are a continuation of the abuse, a continuation of the efforts to control you. It’s a way of saying, you’re not allowed to make decisions for yourself unless you justify to *him*, to *his* satisfaction, that you have an argument that *he* thinks is good enough.

But the reality is, you can – and should – just say “no” to his demands, and that is enough. He’s not entitled to an explanation, and when he demands one, you’re absolutely in your rights to just say “no.

tincancam −  So 31 is not old!! I kept reading your post and was thinking of someone who was pushing 40, because that’s how old you were making yourself out to be. Then I realized, youre only two years older than me! I haven’t even finished college yet! There’s time to find a better man and have a kid. My mom had me at 41.

The thing is, if you don’t get out now you’re just gonna waste even more years on him. The best time to leave him was years ago, the second best time is right now! Also, I want you to realize that you have worth. I read your comments in the old post and you kept making excuses for him.

Like it was ok for him to say those things to you because youre not a child. No, its not ok. You have the same worth as a child. Remember that you dont deserve to be spoken to like that.

Also, he’s totally gonna pretend to not understand why you’re leaving him. He knows damn well what he’s done, it’s just a manipulation technique to play ignorant. Don’t fall for it. Just leave him, he’ll know why

BlancheDevereux −  You could meet somebody else and have kids at almost any age. Why are you saying it will be impossible for you to do so at 31?? Seems Odd to prioritize one hypothetical future (that seems quite unlikely as it is) over your actual sanity and well being.

EDIT: are all of you simply not counting adopted kids as kids? How selfish and hurtful does one need to be to say that ‘you cant have kids after X age’ meanwhile there are scores of kids who would benefit from being adopted but you dont even consider this as an option? wtf. the globe is already overpopulated, but kids dont count as kids unless that came out of your organs? give me a break.

nonoinformation −  Hey there! I know it’s hard right now, incredibly hard. But being alone isn’t as scary as you might think. You will have the chance to find yourself again and to work on who you want to be. You can go and have fun without having to compromise with a partner. And you won’t have to tolerate any treatment by your partner, just because you love them.

You say you can’t have children if you leave now. But you can’t have children now either, not when your husband abuses you and would absolutely abuse his own children as well. If you have children with him, he will abuse them and you could never cut contact to him fully because of the children.

My parents met when they were about your age, and they clicked and had me four years later at 35. You still have time to find someone good for you to have children with. And if you don’t find someone before your biological clock ticks out, you can look into fostering and adoption.

You could even get pregnant on your own if you have the resources. You don’t NEED this abusive person of a husband to fulfill your dream of being a mother. And he would not give you what you want. Any day you stay with him is a day where he can abuse you and break you down further.

About the divorce and divorce talks: talk to a lawyer and get your affairs in order before you tell him. Think about money (do you have a separate account, do you have an income, what would you need to find another place to live), important documents, items you don’t want to lose. You don’t OWE him a lot of talks about this.

Chances are, he won’t understand what he is doing. He would’ve changed his behavior if he knew and cared, but he most likely just doesn’t care and doesn’t WANT to care because it means effort and guilt for him.

If you can, talk to friends and family about his behavior and that you need a place to stay for sometime until you get on your feet. You can try to explain to your husband why you’re divorcing him. (don’t make it a debate. He will think he can sway you into not divorcing, but if you don’t divorce, you WILL be stuck with this abuse forever.

He’s not going to change.) You should however be ready to leave in case he escalates. Tell someone you trust when you’re doing the confrontation, and tell them that they should come over if you haven’t told them that you’re safe within the next three or four hours.

I’m so sorry that you’re going through this. The rest of your marriage might have been happy, but deal breakers exist for a reason. And abuse should definitely be a reason to break the deal of marriage. He broke his vows first by abusing you. Get help in your support system (friends, family) and talk to them. You don’t have to do this all on your own.

Leaving an emotionally abusive relationship is incredibly tough, especially when there are moments of happiness intertwined with pain. The inner conflict between wanting to stay and knowing the relationship is harmful is something many can relate to. Have you ever been in a similar situation, or do you have any advice for those struggling with this difficult decision? Please share your thoughts in the comments below.