AITA for using dead parents to win an argument?
A young man, whose Pakistani parents passed away when he was 16, argued with his brother about teaching Urdu to his brother’s children. The brother’s wife, who only speaks English, feels uncomfortable with them learning a language she can’t understand.
The younger brother brought up how disappointed their parents would be if the family’s language and culture faded, which upset his brother deeply. Now, while he regrets his words, his brother has agreed to reconsider. Read the original story below…
‘ AITA for using dead parents to win an argument?’
Ok, so I 21M, have an older brother, Omar, 26M, who has a 2 year old son, and another child on the way. Our parents were originally from Pakistan, but moved to the UK long before we were born. They taught us Urdu at home and we flew back to Pakistan often in our childhood.
When I was 16, they died.
Omar ended up marrying his wife Lily, who is monolingual and more than a little embarrassed about it, since most people in our family and even her friends speak at least 2. So she decided she did not want her kids to learn Urdu, since she couldn’t and she didn’t want to feel like more of an outsider.
If you don’t know, Urdu can be a pretty difficult language to learn in adulthood, so she can’t speak it. Omar was upset about this but eventually agreed. I’ve been talking to him recently and he said that while he does really want his children to learn, he just can’t bring himself to fight with Lily.
We got into a bit of an argument, if he didn’t start as kids, then his children wouldn’t be able to learn it in adulthood, and would probably even have difficulty as teenagers. I reminded him that he and I both used to make fun of the white-washed kids, and did he really not want his kids to be able to communicate properly with half of the family?
He told me he knew all this, and he wanted them to learn, he was just scared of Lily’s reaction, I told him what he should really be scared of is our parent’s reaction. They worked so hard to keep the culture and mother-tongue going, how would they feel to know their grand-kids wouldn’t be able to speak their language?
Omar looked like he was about to cry, which I’ve never seen him do, told me that was too far and walked off. I know I fucked up. I shouldn’t have said that. But Omar called me earlier today and told me he’d work on it. I’m still feeling really guilty, AITA?
Here’s the comments of Reddit users:
I_Will_in_Me_Hole − NAH – He’s an adult and can make his own decisions. You gave him something to think about that he hadn’t considered. As long as you don’t keep badgering him about it now.
Fabulous-Blue-804 − NTA. Omar is being abused. That’s the upset. Deliberately separating a person from their culture is abuse. It’s a power and control thing. Interesting twist: the wife openly admits this is a power thing. She doesn’t want to feel powerless in the face of her children doing better in life than she did.
It’s also not true that adults can never learn a new language. English is also really hard to get in adulthood, but loads of people do it. An adult might never speak without an accent, but they can certainly learn enough to follow a conversation.
I’m terrible with languages. Seriously. Probably bottom 5% at learning them. I’m also a sped teacher who’s worked with plenty of kids who have been excused from learning a second language due to disability.
There is such a thing as people who seriously cannot learn a new language, but you’re not describing it. This idea that just being 18 years old means that you will not be able to learn is a myth. Generally, you need some pretty serious auditory processing disorder, or Intellectual disability.
But other than that, she could learn. She’s choosing not to. Her language is the dominant language. She doesn’t need Urdu to maintain her position in your society. To her, it’s not worth the effort it would take to end up speaking Urdu badly. But that’s on her. She shouldn’t be punishing her children for her CHOICE to not learn.
eefr − NTA. Lily is completely unreasonable. Cutting their kids off from half of their heritage is cruel and unacceptable. He should put his foot down and teach them Urdu while they’re still young enough to learn to be fluent. I would literally d**p someone for this.
I think it’s perfectly fine that you brought up your parents. You didn’t do it manipulatively; you made a completely valid point about your heritage and the values your parents raised you with. It hurt because he knows you’re right.
Sooty_Grouse − NTA It is so good for children to learn multiple languages while their brains can take it in, and they are so fortunate to have family who can teach them. Language is deeply important to understanding the context of one’s culture.
I think it was appropriate to mention your parents, though depending how you did it, that could warrant an apology. It’s a valid concern but you seem to know it’s not good to weaponize something like that.
Going forward it would be more productive for you to focus on finding ways to support your brother talking to his wife in positive ways about this, and giving her confidence to try to learn some. It may be difficult but it isn’t impossible, and she can at least work on learning some very basic things.
I don’t know if Lily is white but as a white person myself…. It is verrrrry uncomfortable for us to experience being the outsider/minority (for once) – and that is why it is all the more important that we *do* have those experiences. I sincerely hope the best for you all!
[Reddit User] − NTA. I’m pakistani myself. And you’re right. Those kids will have a hard time growing up not speaking urdu, and they deserve the chance to learn their heritage properly.
That being said, a gentler approach may be necessary. For Lily to have the final decision on their kids learning their father’s language and for your brother to be ***’scared’*** of her reaction is slightly concerning
Pizza-love − NTA. Not teaching them a mother tongue because egos is the worst. How is Lily gonna react when they get spanish, French, German or Chinese at school?
Also, understanding more than one language eases up the learning of other languages, especially from English, since English has a lot less conjugation forms, not to start about gender formats (all is just the), does not differ between informal and formal forms in the language either (everybody is just you).
For example, French knows le and la nous (male and female), also tu and vous. Knowing this from another language helps learning other languages a lot, as you are familiar with this concept.
LostMarbles207 − So learning Urdu as an adult is more difficult than as a child but doable. My dad learned it while I was in my mid-elementary/early teens which is why I didn’t grow up speaking it. This is between your brother and his wife.
As a halfie, I think his wife is 100% wrong. It’s hard visiting family there and not understanding, but a lot of people work on learning English. It’s a good skill to have anyway. But I also get the wife’s POV because if the family isn’t welcoming and trying to accommodate her at times, it will be VERY lonely having no one else to talk to.
Luckily my family is super awesome and my mom doesn’t care. Doesn’t make the wife right but I get her POV . Now, commenting on how you guys made fun of whitewashed kids is not cool. These kids are going to be halfies anyway, which already makes them different than you and your brother. Your brother has to do this for himself and his kids not because you pushed him.
9and3of4 − YTA. YTA for laughing at children that wanted to integrate to the country they live in and had no reason to learn the language of a country they don’t intend to visit, YTA for telling someone their parent’s opinion would be more important than the opinion of their partner (you’re obviously not in a committed relationship yet).
This is something between him and his wife, and he definitely should have another discussion with her about it as there’s not really a downside to learning the language for the kids, but it really doesn’t have anything to do with your parents or you.
Cent1234 − YTA. I reminded him that he and I both used to make fun of the white-washed kids . Casual racism, nice. Sorry those kids weren’t culturally orthodox enough for you. I told him what he should really be scared of is our parent’s reaction.They’re dead. They cannot have a reaction.
They worked so hard to keep the culture and mother-tongue going, how would they feel to know their grand-kids wouldn’t be able to speak their language?
Well, this is how your brother felt, and was looking for support from you, but instead you turned on the flamethrower,
and now he knows that his own family cares less about him and his children as people, and more about him as a language instructor. And will dismiss his kids as ‘white-washed’ and think of them as damaged goods.
angeliniana − NTA for raising your parents, but you should’ve been more gentle. Rather than making it sound like an argument you should have made it more like advice.
Did he cross the line, or was it a necessary push? Share your thoughts below!
